So, I guess that's the end of my introduction.
Can you all hear me?
Can you hear in the back?
Yeah? Not very well?
Make them hear in the back.
Okay.
Ah, that's much better, isn't it?
Is it better in the back?
Good, good.
Well, I would like to join with Roy
in thanking all of the people who made this possible.
Mary Fowler worked long and hard to make this happen.
Eric Ali did the wonderful graphics for the poster.
Pam here has controlled and managed traffic flow here this evening.
Diane and Roy are incomparable treasures in the L.A. community.
I was talking to someone today who said
they had listened to KPFK very carefully
in the month that Roy and Diane were away
and it just ain't the same thing.
It's terrifying to think that two human beings
in a city of, what, 11 million
are what's holding up the hip end of things.
As Roy said, this is a benefit for KPFK
and in a larger sense for Botanical Dimensions.
Botanical Dimensions is the non-profit
that Kat and I and Rupert Sheldrake
and Ralph Metzner, Ralph Abraham, Frank Barr,
a number of people have organized
to carry out plant rescue operations
for medicinal plants
and plants with a history of shamanic usage.
And we have a botanical farm in Hawaii, 20 acres,
maintain collectors in South America
and occasionally support collecting in Africa.
And this is our real-world political work
beyond the communicating and the publishing
and that sort of thing
where we actually try to impact
some of the negative, so-called progressive changes
that are taking place in the third world
and disrupting rainforest culture
and causing this shamanic and folk pharmacopoeia
to be lost.
So I appreciate your being here tonight
in support of that.
It's very important work,
far more expensive than I thought it was
when we organized the foundation
and it's ongoing,
so we never really seem to be ahead.
So I want to thank you for your support of that.
In line with that,
I've been living with Kat and our two children
in Hawaii on the Big Island for the past year
and not really doing any public speaking
because there was none to be done there.
And it was a very good opportunity
to get out from under the electronic umbrella
of the sprawl of North American culture
and to sort of look at it and assess it
as this practice of speaking with groups of people
has become more and more a part of my life.
It has sort of changed in my mind
from the addressing of certain topics
and the building of a talk around a theme
to more just pointing and looking
and saying,
well, here we are.
Here's where we've arrived tonight.
What is the situation?
What is the state of the world?
What is the state of the union?
I think psychedelics had a very large impact.
I'm sure there's no argument on this
in the 1960s.
But in a way,
it was not ever anchored in anything.
It was never explained to anybody,
by anybody,
how it fit into the historical context
of what had preceded it,
perhaps because no one actually knew at that time.
For instance,
there was no...
The invoking of shamanism
as an explanation
for how plant hallucinogens work on psyche
is completely alien to the literature of the 1960s.
It just isn't there.
And speaking of aliens,
the theme of alien intelligence
or of hyperdimensional organized intellect
is contacted in the psychedelic state.
That also was an absent theme.
It was basically presented,
it, the psychedelic experience,
was basically presented
as an exploration
of the contents of the personality
with a little bit of overflow
into aesthetic issues.
So I remember in the early days
we would stack our Abrams books
on Hieronymus Bosch
and Piera della Francesca
and Giotto.
And then the idea
following Aldous Huxley
was that you would
that you would imbibe the meaning
of these great works of art
behind the kind of psychic freedom
that the psychedelic substance
was going to graft on
to your ordinary consciousness.
Well, I think all those kinds of metaphors
were useful,
but it's been now 20, 25 years
of looking at that phenomenon
and also of having the future
continue to overtake us
with ever more demands
upon our cultural resourcefulness
and our ability to cognize
the cultural situation.
And I think now
it can be seen
somewhat differently.
And so these two nights
in Los Angeles
which are called
Understanding and Imagination
in the Light of Nature
are a kind of effort
to take several telescoping steps backward
and place the adventure
of psychedelic self-exploration
in context
to frame it
in a number of different ways
because I think
it's very important for us
to know
as the Hermetic Mysteries
urge us to know
whether we have come
where we are
who we are
and whence we are going
all issues
that the psychedelic experience
especially to my mind
the plant hallucinogens
bring into close focus.
Here is an opportunity
for a theater
of cultural growth
that is unparalleled.
How did we find ourselves
in this situation?
What is exactly
the nature of the cultural situation
in which then
the psychedelic response
is called forth
as part of a spectrum
of cultural responses?
Basically what's been going on
in Western civilization
for about 500 years
is the exploration
of the metaphor
of materialism
which began
as a simple
limiting case
since we are
at the Philosophical Research Society
it behooves us
to talk philosophy
for a moment
and remind you
that there is
what's called
Occam's razor.
William of Occam
was a late medieval philosopher
and his razor
was that hypotheses
should not be multiplied
without necessity
without necessity.
In other words
the simplest explanation
should be preferred
in all cases.
the fewest number
of elements
should be put forward
as necessary
for an explanation.
And following
William of Occam's
statement
of this notion
as a logical way
of proceeding
the assumption
was made
then
a provisional assumption
at the beginning
that matter
could be
separated
from the notion
of soul
and spirit
that it could be
divided
into its simplest
units
and out of the activity
of those
simple units
a model
could be built up
that would explain
more complex
phenomena
in the world
Cartesian materialism
which
was applied
very successfully
to
physical matter
to the chemical elements
and
so successfully
in fact
that the provisional
nature
of the assumption
was soon
forgotten
in the
explanatory
zeal
of the people
who had latched
onto this method
and so it was then
applied
out of the chemical realm
but moved into
the biological realm
and the search
was on
for the biologically
irreducible units
which
in the 17th century
was the cell
in great excitement
about the cell
and then
in the 20th century
of course
first the nucleus
of the cell
then ultimately
DNA
as the
constituent
of the nucleus
which was
controlling
protein synthesis
but strangely
enough
the
elucidation
of the mechanics
of the gene
through this
program
of reductionism
did not
issue into
the same
kind of
control
over the
products
of the gene
that the
same program
had
the same
kind of fruit
that had been
born in the
analysis of
physical matter
and in the
early years
of this century
when the effort
was made
to extend
the metaphor
into
psychology
the true
inadequacy
of it
became
clearly seen
so that
the effort
to break
the personality
down into
types
or complexes
or archetypes
or behavioral
strategies
all
failed
and at the
same time
that this
process
of
disconfirmation
was happening
in the
social sciences
physics
which had
been old
reliable
in the
matter
of
supporting
this
particulate
pointillistic
materialistic
school of
explanation
began in
fact to
betray it
because the
analysis of
matter was
pushed to
deeper and
deeper levels
until finally
phenomena
began to
be elucidated
which
seemed
incomprehensible
in the
mechanical
model
it seemed
as though
what had
been thought
of as
points of
matter
were in
fact spread
through
time
and the
notion of
simple
location
began to
give way
to talk
of clouds
of probability
and this
sort of
thing
all of
this
reaching
a culmination
in 1923
with the
Copenhagen
conference
on quantum
physics
where
basically
a new
vision of
matter
was
elucidated
and strangely
enough the
new view
of matter
seemed
to have
a very
mentalist
sort of
aura
about it
it no
longer was
a theory
of simple
location
calculable
energies
and
specific
predictions
it was
probabilistic
now this
re-emergence
of the
need for
a wave
mechanical
description
of matter
can I
think now
be seen
from the
vantage point
of 55
years
as the
first
stirrings
or among
the first
stirrings
of the
re-emergence
of the
spirit
and I
think that
what
understanding
and imagination
in the
light of
nature
argues
for
is
the
presence
and
re-emergence
of the
awareness
of spirit
in the
world
this is
what
the
so-called
and long
heralded
paradigm
shift
is all
about
it is
a
vast
turning
over
of the
intellectual
universe
which will
eclipse
many idea
systems
and support
many more
it is the
idea of
fields
spirit
need not
be defined
or even
conceived
in any
sort of
19th century
or mentalist
or animist
way
what spirit
is
a field
of
deployed
energy
that is
somehow
co-present
at more
than one
point
in space
and time
it is
the shadow
that haunts
the particularized
world
of Newtonian
matter
and it is
strangely enough
the commonest
object of
experience
in other
words
as we
move
through
our
lives
as we
project
our
hopes
as we
plan
our
days
as we
execute
our
jobs
we
move
in this
realm
of
spirit
the problem
is
that we
have
been
very
slowly
but
very
efficiently
corralled
inside
an intellectual
system
which gives
no credence
to spirit
and therefore
has had a
curious
effect
on the
validation
that we
give our
own lives
for instance
if you
look at
positivist
philosophy
which is
the
dominant
philosophical
paradigm
in academic
philosophy
there you
learn that
there are
primary
and secondary
qualities
to
the world
and the
primary
qualities
are
charge
spin
angular
momentum
velocity
this sort
of thing
things which
nowhere come
tangential
to the
felt
world
of the
individual
well then
there are
also
so-called
secondary
qualities
color
taste
tone
feeling
all the
things
that make
up the
world
that you
and I
experience
so somehow
we are not
traveling in
first class
on this
metaphysical
airliner
you know
we're back
there with
the secondary
qualities
and the
good stuff
is all
up front
and it
is described
and manipulated
by
incomprehensible
equations
and you
have to
enter into
a priesthood
to become
part of it
well
it's to our
credit I think
that we are
waking up
and one of the
reasons that we
are waking up
is because
into the
objects of
common
experience
by an
exhaustive
search of
the objects
of common
experience
diligent
clear
thinking
seekers
after
understanding
people who
are practicing
who took
seriously the
constitution's
assurance of
the pursuit
of happiness
have
Robert Bork
notwithstanding
have found
more than the
right of
privacy in the
constitution
but have
actually found
the right
to alter
your own
consciousness
for purposes
of personal
growth
well
consciousness
is like
a still
pool
if it is
unperturbed
it returns
a clear
image of
the world
in the same
way that the
unperturbed
surface of a
pond will
become a
mirror to
the environment
around it
but if
consciousness
is perturbed
by being
shifted from
its ordinary
modalities
then
the
extraordinary
tenuous
and
provisional
nature
of what
we call
reality
swims
into our
ken
and we
see
you know
that what
we take
to be
solid
objects
what we
take
to be
here
and now
what we
take
to be
personal
identity
versus
other
in the
form of
other
personalities
that all
of these
things
hang
by the
most tenuous
of linguistic
threads
and cultural
conventions
and that
beneath the
surface of
those conventions
is utter
terra incognito
a no man's
land
the unexplored
territory
behind cultural
assumptions
suddenly
starkly
totally
incontrovertibly
illuminated
to the
inspection
of the
individual
well
this
is
feeding
indeed
to my
mind
it is
the major
factor
responsible
for
the
re-emergence
of the
awareness
of the
spirit
it holds
out the
possibility
that we
can create
a new
definition
of our
own
humanness
that it
was fine
for purposes
of disentangling
from the
medieval
church
to take
the
materialist
route
and to
follow it
into
Darwinian
evolution
to
recognize
our
ascent
from
previous
primate
forms
and to
sort of
claim
a dimension
of
existential
freedom
but that
is
not the
whole
story
that
essentially
is the
legacy
or the
achievement
of
modernism
which
was
fully
worked
out
by
or
I would
say
I mean
those
people
the
pataphysicians
the
quantum
physicists
the
dadas
the
surrealists
Alfred
Jarry
Andre
Breton
it was
all
worked
out
and
those
of us
who were
born
after
that
time
and
have
come
into
this
sort
of
pseudo
eschaton
of
regurgitation
of
modern
values
in
art
fashion
and
literature
have
been
living
in
this
kind
of
a
goldfish
bowl
ever
since
I mean
really
it's
astonishing
the
century
in
the
last
ten
or
twenty
for that
matter
there
has
also
been
an
extraordinary
backward
current
a
very
strong
recidivism
that
has
held
at
bay
the
true
exfoliation
of
what
modernity
was supposed
to
mean
that's
why
within
the
20th
century
the
further
back
you
go
the
more
utopian
the
projection
of
the
future
becomes
and
the
20th
century
you
go
the
more
like
a
dystopia
it
becomes
as
we
get
not
elevated
railways
immortality
and
hot
pants
but
you
know
bread
lines
and
germ
warfare
and
doublespeak
and all
of these
things
so
into
this
situation
of
retrenchment
and cultural
recidivism
and the
working out
of
modern
values
which are
materialist
values
comes
then
the
beginning
of the
postmodern
era
I
prefer a
different
term
which I
call
compressionism
the
compressionist
era
which
follows
the
modern
era
and
its
theme
is
the
reemergence
of the
presence
is
the
discovery
of
relativism
with
regard
to
consciousness
which
does
not
only
mean
psychedelic
drugs
and
hallucinogenic
plants
per se
it also
means
media
it also
means
literary
expectation
reorientation
of the
senses
through
design
urban
planning
the
entire
spectrum
of
effects
which
feeds
consciousness
back
into
itself
is
enunciating
this
theme
of the
emergent
spirit
and it
is not
necessarily
a welcome
theme
because
all
institutions
attain a
certain
momentum
toward the
preservation
of their
own vested
interests
and
science
and the
handmaiden
of science
which is
modern
technocratic
government
have
created
a number
of cultural
institutions
that
have a
friction
with the
reemergence
of the
spirit
first and
foremost
is the
notion
of the
public
the
public
is this
weird
idea
that was
generated
in the
wake of
the
printing
press
that
there
were
vast
numbers
of
people
who
could
be
treated
atomistically
they
didn't
have to
be
thought
of
as
individuals
they
could
be
thought
of
as
various
classes
masses
of people
to be
manipulated
and if
you could
sell
these
the
public
on the
idea
of
democracy
which
is
another
one
of
these
atomistic
notions
the
notion
of
democracy
is
that
for
us
all
to
get
together
and
have
work
themselves
out
what
they
don't
tell
you
is
that
at
the
same
time
that
you
build
this
definition
of
the
citizen
you
also
build
the
institutions
which
subvert
the
citizen
so
the
citizen
is
not
free
to
act
out
and
express
the
wishes
of
the
propaganda
so
there's
this
peculiar
playing
off
of
one
against
the
other
in
the
meantime
what
has
also
been
happening
is
the
institutions
of
language
which
previously
were
pretty much
left to
develop
on their
own
and
that
was
the
situation
well
into
the
19th
century
through
the
power
of
the
printing
press
the
evolution
of
language
also
became
something
under
the
control
of
these
institutions
and
they
very
quickly
have
replaced
whatever
reality
may have
been
impinging
into
the
lives
of
the
citizens
with
concepts
replace
reality
you
come
into
the
world
with
a
blank
slate
and
everything
is
what
William
James
called
a
blooming
buzzing
confusion
well
then
one
by
one
you
isolate
phenomena
in
this
confusion
and
you
name
it
once
a
sector
of
reality
has
been
named
it
stays
still
it
ceases
to
behave
the
way
it
would
behave
for
itself
it
begins
to
behave
syntactically
because
it
has
been
changed
into
a
linguistic
object
when
things
behave
syntactically
they
are
either
subjects
or
objects
or
the
syntactical
machinery
which
relates
these
two
together
in
that
case
materialism
dualism
projection
of
authenticity
beyond
the
self
are
all
reinforced
so
these
are
the
factors
which
have
impeded
the
spirit
into
this
comes
the
psychedelic
experience
it
has
a
tremendous
force
to
revivify
the
spirit
particularly
because
it
is
not
an
ideology
it
is
not
something
someone
figured
out
it
is
an
experience
and
this
is
important
to
bear
in
mind
it
horrifies
me
I'm
sure
you've
heard
me
say
it
to
think
of
someone
going
from
birth
to
the
grave
without
ever
coming
tangential
to
the
psychedelic
experience
it's
like
going
from
the
birth
to
the
grave
without
ever
discovering
sex
it
means
that
you
died
as
a
pre
adolescent
you
know
you
never
really
came
into
your
birth
right
and
we
have
been
infantilized
by
our
to
accept
the
notion
of
ourselves
as
citizens
consuming
this
regurgitated
scientific
models
which are
then
hashed
through
by
Madison
Avenue
and
then
handed
down
to
us
by
the
organs
of
mass
culture
and
this
is
supposed
to
be
what
we
anchor
our
lives
on
it's
no
wonder
that
drug
abuse
child
abuse
self
abuse
is
rampant
in
this
society
because
it
all
has
been
taken
away
from
us
you
may
read
and
think
well
thank
god
it
isn't
that
bad
yet
well
the
only
difference
between
us
and
is
we
dress
better
so
I
this
meeting
was
sold
out
I
could
I
have
to
see
you
I
have
to
I
have
to
before there was any promo
other than Roy's show
and a small mailing we did.
So you are people who have passed through
a very narrow filter.
You stay up late.
You listen to KPFK
and you tolerate Terrence McKemma.
So you are either thrice blessed
or thrice cursed.
I don't know which it is.
But anyway, it feels to me
like a family gathering.
It feels to me like
we are figuring this out
and there aren't that many of us, I think.
But what we understand as a group
or what I imagine that we understand
is that there is this twilight of reductionism.
There is this end of the old model
and yet we're not ready to proclaim
the twilight of reductionism
to simultaneously be the funeral of reason.
You see, there are a lot of people,
a much larger group than we represent
who are prepared to bury reason
along with reductionism.
and I think reason
may have been caught in bed
with reductionism
but it may have been set up
is the take that I have on it.
And as they used to say in Watergate,
linked but not tainted.
I am a very
some people even
someone said I was
I was accused of being
narrow-minded the other night
because
I come to this
very honestly
through the sciences
through trying to
really find out
what was going on
and not just accept everything
that came down the pike.
I mean, I will believe anything
if there's evidence,
if it's self-consistent,
if the case
is well made.
I mean, I think that the first thing
the truth will be
is
a pleasure to hear.
You know, and not some
turgid and tormented thing
where you have to go to six meetings
and not talk to anybody
who doesn't believe it
and all of this sort of thing.
So I think
it's important
as the
what I call
the archaic revival
gets rolling
it is important
for us to clarify
where we are coming from.
When we were simply
the lunatic fringe
of the lunatic fringe
it hardly mattered.
But responsibility
will devolve on us
to say what we mean
and to
have a position
which is
not only convincing
to the converted
but convincing
to the skeptics.
That's who I'm after.
You know,
because I think
that a great
instance of cultural blindness
is what we're confronted with
on the issue
of psychedelics.
Psychedelics are
to the science
of psychology
what the telescope
was
to astronomy
in Galileo's time.
And we are
in a situation
of increasing
global pressure
on our species,
increasing
outbreaks
of neurosis,
unhappiness,
psychic epidemics.
and we are
leaving our
best tools
behind
because of
fairly preposterous
cultural
prohibitions.
Cultural
prohibitions
which deny us
our best
weapons
for overcoming
the situation
that we are in.
And this is
really an intolerable
situation
because
the fate,
nothing less
than the fate
of the human
species
probably hangs
in the balance.
We cannot afford
the luxury
of an unconscious.
We cannot afford
stupidity,
closed-mindedness,
racism,
sexism,
consumer materialism,
selfishness,
an absence
of globalism.
These things
are not necessary
for us
for our moral
edification
so that we can
feel like
well-bred ladies
and gentlemen.
These things
are necessary
for us
so that we
don't destroy
ourselves.
And the fact
that
this message
is so slow
coming out
is a strong
argument
for activism
on the part
of anybody
who thinks
they have
even the faintest
glimmer
of what is
going on.
You know,
the future
will not wait.
I see
the most
crypto-fascist
and intransigent
of institutions
slowly waking up
to fairly
basic facts
such as
that a
nuclear war
is probably
a bad
investment.
you know,
so that
even
as
Neanderthal
a type
as
President
Pinocchio
is willing
isn't that
a cruel
thing
for me
to say
is
waking up
to the
fact
that
it just
don't pay.
But you know,
we have a lot
of problems.
it isn't going
to be the
millennium
even if we
achieve a
massive cutback
in strategic
weapons.
There's still
going to be
propaganda,
sexism,
starvation,
inability to
correctly manage
resources.
These things
will plague us
unto
the last
syllable
of recorded
time
unless we
begin
to undergo
this kind
of
intellectual
cohesion,
the compression
of our
intent,
the
recognition
of our
group-mindedness
as a
feeling,
as a
will
that can
act
in the
historical
context.
And to my
mind,
the psychedelics
have always
existed
in the
plants to
promote
precisely this.
There were
not language
using tool
making tribes
of human
beings in
the absence
of hallucinogenic
plants.
The
hallucinogenic
plants create
the context
for integrated
organizational
activity.
This
has been
going on
for at
least
15,
20,000
years.
The
problem
is that
through
a series
of factors
which we
needn't go
into in
depth here,
but factors
which impinged
on European
civilization
particularly,
civilizations
were able
to evolve
outside of
the noetic
input from
Gaia,
outside of
the biological
radio that
envelops the
planet and
inputs into
balanced
tribal societies
with functioning
shamanic
institutions.
In Europe,
somehow the
chain was
broken.
The link
back to
the elder
gods and
goddesses and
to the
biological
organization of
human society
before history
was lost.
And this
curious kind
of ungoverned
intellectual
development
occurred,
ungoverned
in the literal
sense of a
machine which
slips from the
control of
its governor.
And in
that situation,
materialism,
which is an
insupportable
philosophy
actually, if
you have an
openness, a
sensitivity, any
kind of
cultivated feminine
response to
nature, it is
utterly impossible.
Recall that the
Cartesian, the
point of view of
Cartesian
materialism pushed
Descartes to
actually claiming in
public debate that
animals were
machines.
He said they
feel nothing.
The apparent
display of
pain is
simply something
which we
project onto
them because
we alone have
a soul.
And Descartes,
you see, himself
had not gone over
completely to
materialism.
He believed
there was a
human soul, but
it came
tangential at
only one point
to the human
body.
Somewhere in
the pineal
gland, there
was a switch
and the soul
was running
things like a
telephone switch
board operator
from there.
Well, very
shortly after
Descartes, his
followers just
said, well, we
don't need this.
This soul
concept was just
a thing to stay
on the right
side of the
church and we
don't need it.
And they cut
it loose.
Well, once you
cut that loose,
then you have
all kinds of
permission.
You have
permission to
rape and
exploit nature,
permission which
had already been
reinforced for
Western man by
the New Testament,
but now raised
to the nth degree
by the assumption
that nature is
utterly without
soul.
And this
philosophy persisted
well into the
1950s.
The essence of
Jean-Paul Sartre's
existentialism can
be summed up in
the statement
nature is
mute.
That was
Sartre's
position on
nature.
How many
people thinking
themselves
existentialists and
hanging out in
coffee houses
actually ever
worked through
what the
consequences of
the existential
point of view
was?
Nature is not
mute.
You really have
to have worked
yourself into a
weird place.
to believe
that, you
know.
In fact,
nature is
entirely
something else.
Nature is
communication
because nature
is psyche.
This is what
we haven't
understood.
We have
somehow talked
ourselves into
the belief that
into the natural
world of Eden
God came
and made
man and
from man
woman.
and that
men and
women are
of so
ontologically
a different
level than
the rest of
nature that
no conclusion
about us
can be drawn
from an
examination of
nature.
Nothing could,
I mean,
it's impossible
for me to
understand how
this idea
persists and
has such
momentum in the
20th century
theory where
hierarchy
theory has
very, very
clearly
explicated the
notion of
the linkage of
higher order
systems to
subsystems that
are physically
more simple.
So you see,
really what we
have is a
kind of fractal
universe.
in fact,
it's not
greatly different
from the
alchemical view
of the 16th
century where
people said
as above,
so below.
The microcosm
is a reflection
of the
macrocosm.
What this is
really saying
is that at
the level of
a planet,
you get a
certain level
of organization
and spectrum
of peripheral
effects.
the same
thing such
as self
reflection,
self
regulation,
intent,
goal
projection,
steering toward
perceived
goals.
You get
the same
kind of
thing on
the level
of a
society,
can be
a beehive
or a
herd of
antelope
or whatever,
and you
get it in
the human
individual
and the
human
society.
So,
really what
is to
be seen
is that
we are
the
cutting
edge
of
becoming.
We are
not a
thing
apart.
We are
a unique
level
of a
multi-leveled
organism,
and we
have been
called
forth
out of
nature,
by nature,
for a
purpose.
And what
is our
task as
individuals,
I think,
is to
discover what
that purpose
is,
and then
to align
ourselves
with it
in a way
which allows
the plan,
whatever it
is,
to most
smoothly
unfold.
Well,
what it
seems to
be is a
progressive
invocation
of
spirit,
the theme
with which I
began the
evening,
that through
language,
through
abstraction,
through
magical
invocation,
the
formulation
of
religions,
the
projection
of
art,
the
field
phenomena,
the
phenomena
which are
diffuse in
space and
time,
and not
easily
located,
are
forcing or
intruding their
way into
three-dimensional
space and
time.
if you
were an
extraterrestrial
in a
starship in
orbit around
this planet,
what you
would see
looking down
is a
gene swarm.
The
species that
seem to
us to be
animal forms
extremely stable
in time are
actually highly
permeable
membranes
over
millennia and
tens of
millennia,
with genes
crossing over,
moving around,
and being
basically
obedient to
the expression
of some
kind of
teleological
form,
and it
was the
concern of
19th century
biology to
eliminate
teleology,
to eliminate
purpose and
directedness,
but it's
very hard to
avoid the
impression of
some kind
of
attractor
ahead of
this planet
embedded in
its history
and somehow
channeling
everything
toward it
so that
the progressive
acceleration of
human society,
of information
production,
of communication,
the proliferation
of languages,
natural and
synthetic,
all of these
things are
not something
going on in
the human
domain and
somehow
sealed from
the general
state of
nature,
but are
in fact
part of
the general
state of
nature,
and the
human
experience
or the
human animal
as the
carrier of
this
catalytic
process,
this speeding
up and
accelerating a
process on
the surface of
the planet
is not
sealed from
nature,
but the
leading edge,
the leading
edge of
a process
on this
planet.
Now,
teleology was
so antithetical
to 19th
century science
because they
were trying to
pull away
from the
telos of
medieval
scholastic
philosophy.
They didn't
want God,
these 19th
century English
atheists,
Darwin and
Lyle and
that crowd.
However,
we have
come through
the so-called
death of God
and the
elimination of
a theological
raison d'etre
for the
universe,
and now
we're looking
more at
a telos
which we
would
operationally
define,
rather than
define it
based on
ancient
revelation,
which was
the previous
method was
the older
the book,
the truer
it must be,
and the
Bible is the
oldest book,
and therefore
it must be
true.
This is
what
Merci Eliade
calls the
nostalgia
for paradise,
paradigm of
time.
We are
in that,
it can
now be
seen that
there is
in fact
some kind
of transcendental
object,
and it's
best to
try and
describe it
phenomenologically.
We don't know
what it is,
but we do
know that
it's an
enormous
attractor
of some
sort,
and we
are in
the field
of attraction,
and by we
I mean all
life on
the planet
is being
drawn in
to this
nodal
point,
and it
is possible
to anticipate
it through
the psychedelic
experience,
because apparently
the natural
and the
linguistic
world
are worlds
which are
organized along
the principle
of fractal
curves.
fractal
curves are
recently
discovered
mathematical
objects,
not all of
them are
recently
discovered,
some were
known as
late as
the late
19th century,
but most
have been
discovered
using computers
in the last
10 or 15
years,
and they
are self
similar curves
such that
when you
take a
subset of
one of
these
mathematical
objects,
it is
found to
have the
whole
pattern
embedded
in it.
the Fourier
transforms
that
describe
holograms
are
these
kind
of
things,
coastlines,
mountain
ranges,
data of
all sorts
when analyzed
in a certain
way is
found to
be
fractal.
Apparently
the world
is a kind
of vast
spiral
fractal
that is
achieving
greater and
greater
closure
with
itself,
and we
experience
this
density
of
closure
and
this
compression
ism
as
the
spectrum
of
effects
which
we
call
human
evolution,
human
history,
emergence
of high
technology,
the present
moment,
the rush
toward
apocalypse.
The most
intense
moments
that the
universe
has ever
known
are
the
next
seconds,
and
beyond
that
lies
still
more
intense
moments.
Novelty
as a
kind
of
generalized
paradigm
of
the
compression
of
connectedness
throughout
the
cosmos
is
accelerating
moment
by
moment
in the
rocks,
in the
trees,
in the
stars,
and
in us.
And so
what we
call
trendlessly
fluctuating,
that's
their
model
of
the
world.
You
get
order
at
the
atomic
level,
order
at
the
biological
level,
order,
and suddenly
you reach
human
beings,
trendlessly
fluctuating.
It's
as though
we were
affected
by the
Brownian
movement
of
random
particles,
and yet
somehow
out of
less
fluctuation
of
human
history.
Actually,
this is
nonsense.
It's
simply
that
there
has
never
been
a
thorough
going
theory
of
history.
However,
now
we are
ready
for
them
because
these
wave
mechanical
ideas,
the
notions
of
closure,
Sheldrake's
idea about
the
presence
of
the
past,
the
way
in
which
the
past
drives
the
present,
all
of
and
densification
of
time.
And
this
is
what
is
experienced
in
the
psychedelic
experience.
Really,
Whitehead said
of
Dove
Gray
that
it
haunts
time
like
a
ghost.
Well,
I
think
that
the
compression
of
the
three
dimensional
universe
at
the
end
of
time
haunts
time
like
a
ghost.
It's
the
cosmic
giggle.
Hear
a
shaman.
They're
an
ecstatic
poet.
And
they're
the
tiny
ripple
that
is
simply
a
congruent
coincidence
in
the
life
of
a
single
individual.
Robert
Anton
Wilson
called
this
the
cosmic
giggle.
It's
when
something
protrudes
through
the
forward
flowing
momentum
of
rational
casuistry
and
causes
it
to
flow
around
it
and
eddy
and
churn
and
then
you
see
through
for
a
moment
and
you
say
well
what
is
it
there
was
a
plottedness
for
a
moment
there
was
the
hand
of
the
maker
there
but
now
I
don't
see
it
anymore
that
is
the
going
behind
the
veil
that
is
the
seeing
into
the
structure
of
being
that
lies
behind
the
conventionalized
languages
that's
why
coincidence
is so
often
reported
as an
accompanying
phenomenon
for the
psychedelic
experience
because
really
syntax
is
dissolved
and
syntax
is a
filter
for
this
sense
of
eminent
connectedness
and
when
the
syntax
goes
the
eminent
connectedness
flows
in
then
it's a
question
of
what
you
do
with
it
if
it
causes
you
to
believe
that
you
are
going
to
save
the
world
then
you
haven't
gotten
the
message
right
that's
inflation
and
inflation
is very
bad
it
drives
up
interest
rates
so
if
you
get
that
kind
of
a
take
on
it
you
are
misusing
it
nevertheless
the
most
advanced
yogic
techniques
that
are
known
are
the
techniques
of
the
so-called
Anuttatara
yoga
tantra
the
tantric
yogic
techniques
and
there
the
prescription
is
it
says
in
Herbert
Gunther's
Treasures
of the
Tibetan
Middle
Way
you
should
think
of
your
house
as
a
resplendent
palace
think
of
your
utensils
as
made
of
beaten
gold
and
think
of
yourself
as
having
a
body
made
of
living
mercury
what
this
is
in
western
psychological
terms
is
an
invitation
to
inflation
but
if
it
is
approached
with
the
right
analysis
of
mind
basically
that
there is
nothing
but
body
mind
and
there
is
no
particularization
in
time
and
space
then
there
is
no
inflationary
feedback
into
the
ego
and
this
is
the
kind
of
opportunity
that
the
psychedelic
opens
up
it
is
I
have
said
many
times
quoting
Plato
time
is
the
moving
image
of
eternity
time
is
the
moving
image
of
eternity
what
the
shaman
does
is
he
or
she
leaves
the
mundane
plane
and
in
Iliad's
phrase
is
able
to
trigger
a
rupture
of
plane
and
the
rupture
of
plane
carries
the
shamanizing
person
into
another
dimension
literally
another
dimension
and
in
that
other
dimension
all
of
time
and
space
is
beheld
as
James
Joyce
said
in
a
nutshell
and
in
the
nutshell
of
time
and
space
everything
is
seen
to be
a part
and
a
aesthetically
pleasing
integral
necessary
part
of the
transcendental
object
in
what
this
universe
is
a
lower
dimensional
slice
of
that
same
transcendental
object
well
I guess
what impels
my career
and what
I really
can't
get over
is
that
what
I'm
saying
to
you
is
true
you know
that
I mean
we
sit
here
we
gather
here
and
even
though
we're
talking
about
this
extremely
far
out
thing
still
all
the
forms
are
in
place
I'm
here
you're
there
everybody
sits
on
their
ass
nobody
sits
on
their
head
it
all
it
all
appears
fairly
mundane
how
can
it
be
that
what
we
are
talking
about
is
the
nearby
presence
of
an
impossibly
alien
dimension
now
if
that
alien
dimension
had
been
reported
back
to
us
by
a
robot
probe
dropped
into
the
methane
oceans
of
Europa
we
would
be
all
hot
to
go
there
to
organize
a
billion
dollar
expedition
and a
year
plan
and
go
out
there
and
find
out
what
is
happening
the
amazing
thing
is
that
you know
each one
of us
in our
own
living
room
can
be
this
Magellan
can
penetrate
into
these
dimensions
it
really
seems
quite
freaky
to
me
freaky
to
me
that
such
a
thing
is
possible
and
yet
that
we
are
such
monkeys
or
so
culturally
constrained
or
so
blind
that
this
is
not
what
we're
all
talking
about
all
the
time
and
by
we
all
I
mean
all
five
billion
of
us
on
this
planet
because
we
appear
to be
being
pushed
down
a
featureless
corridor
toward
a
furnace
and
yet
if you
would
notice
there
are
all
these
doors
along
the
side
of
the
so-called
featureless
corridor
and
nobody
seems
to
have
cognized
that
you
can
just
open
these
doors
and
walk
through
and
short
circuit
the
inevitability
of
planetary
disaster
amazing
because
we
pride
ourselves
on
our
commitment
that
science
allows us
to look
anywhere
inspect
any
possibility
our
models
are not
dictated
to us
by the
church
or by
government
or by
industry
when in
fact
they are
dictated
to us
by
the
church
government
industry
mammalian
organization
and so
we are
no better
off
than all
those
benighted
people
in those
previous
ages
where we
look back
upon them
and say
well
they must
have been
so limited
by their
worldview
because
they didn't
know
about
quantum
physics
and ketamine
and Michael
Jackson
and cable
TV
and all
of these
things
but the
fact of the
matter is
that unless
we push
through
culture
to nature
we too
are dupes
we too
are somehow
being sold
a line
and
And yet nature is there outside of the cities.
You know, you drive an hour and a half from where we're sitting and you're in the high desert.
And it is demon-haunted, paleolithic space.
It holds the same promise for us as moderns that it held for the Luiseno Indians
who were initiated into it, into their shamanic institution,
before the conquest, before history.
So nature is the final arbiter of cultural forms.
This is what Taoism understood.
And this is what I believe the psychedelic plant thing is pushing us toward.
It was not immediately apparent that this was so.
Because as I said at the beginning of this talk in the 60s,
the psychedelics came out of the laboratory.
And only the most scholarly of the trippers bothered to study the natural origins
and the anthropological and ethnographic context in which these things were coming from,
like the Ellicinian Mysteries or the Mexican Morning Glory Mysteries
or the Wasson discovered Mushroom Mysteries.
But if we can somehow link a respect to nature, a sensitivity to Gaia,
a valuing of ourselves,
a complete placing of our own feelings
and our own perceptions in the forefront of trustworthy sources
and the psychedelics integrated into our lives,
then there will be a tremendous cultural impact, a tremendous reorientation
because the message that nature is trying to give,
the steering signal on the human species,
comes through the accessing of this shamanic dimension outside of history.
Revolutions are made by tiny percentages of the populations
in which those revolutions are wrought.
The important thing is clarity and connectedness
and a clear understanding of who one's antecedents are,
what the source antecedents are,
and what the target goal is.
New Age is a pale label for what is going on.
New Age sounds too much like new Nixon, new Reagan,
new retreaded everything.
What is happening is an archaic revival,
a harking back to cultural models
10,000 to 25,000 years old
because the profane fall into history is actually ending.
The way the fall into history ends
is with the progeny of Adam,
the human race,
recovering
the control of the human form,
the control of the human soul,
the ability to turn ourselves into whatever we wish to be.
This comes through the union of imagination,
through understanding,
into nature,
the invocation of the dream.
This is what the Australian Aboriginal Society is talking about.
This is what the dream time is.
Finnegan's Wake says,
upnient, prospector,
you warp your woof and spread your wings,
sprout all your worth.
This upnient,
this end of time,
this birth into angelhood,
lies ahead of us,
but it is really part of the archaic return
to the paradisiacal mode before history.
The psychedelic hallucinogens are the catalysts.
The minds that they touch
become the catalysts
within the society in general.
And from there,
the fashions,
the social forms,
the kinds of conscientiousness,
the innate decency
that is called forth
by the authenticity
of the experience
is what will transform us.
I mean,
in the same way that
an affair
can become a love affair
if there is mutual authenticity
of behavior
rather than simply a kind of flirting,
flirtation.
In that same way,
our affair with Gaia
can be a love affair
if we can summon
to ourselves
the vision
to make it so.
And it means really being aware
of the vastness of the options,
of the precipice
that late 20th century historical human beings stand on.
We are about to leave for the stars.
This is what is happening on this planet.
A species prepares to depart for the stars.
To do that,
energy has to be marshaled.
The lessons of the long march
out of the trees
and to this moment
have to be collated,
sifted,
refined,
concentrated.
That is the alchemical gold.
The historical process
is the story
of a prodigal son,
of a wandering
and a return.
The return
is meaningless
without the wandering.
The wandering
has no meaning
unless its fruits
are given
birth
after the return.
And I think that
the last thousand years
has been
the prodigal journey
into matter.
And it ends
finally with
modern pharmacology,
modern ethnobotany,
discovering
in the jungles
of the Amazon
and the mountains
of Mexico
the body
of Eros,
Osiris,
you know,
fallen since the time
of the flood
but awaiting
the re-emergence
of the cognizant
human connection.
That is
what
the archaic revival
holds out.
It's actually
our salvation.
I mean,
I think I'm fairly
hard-nosed.
I don't see
any hope
for us.
I don't see
any hope
for institutional
transformation
unless it is done
with an awareness
of the transcendental object.
and the religions
that we inherit
from the past
are so screwed up
that the only way
to validate
and empower
the transcendental object
is by self-experience,
by direct accessing.
And people say,
well,
but can't it be done
on the natch?
No,
it can't be done
on the natch,
generally speaking,
because if it could be,
it would have been done.
I mean,
there are plenty
of elder societies
on this planet
who have the wrap
down,
you know,
but look at the kind
of societies
that they erect.
I mean,
horrifyingly
dehumanized societies
seem to be
the breeding place
of the most sublime
religions there are.
So,
no,
I think it has to be,
there has to be
a humbling.
We have to bow
our heads
and abandon
the dualism
that we inherit
out of our,
out of Christianity
and science
and the whole
Judeo-Christian
Islamic shtick.
We have to realize
that it requires
a symbiotic partner.
It's a hand-in-hand
effort.
And if we are willing
to take the hand
which nature offers
in the strange form
of the alien
vegetation spirit
from the stars
that seems to
infuse us
on plant
hallucinogens,
then we will
go forward
into a bright
new world.
It's a partnership.
It's a challenge.
It's the only game
in the planetary
village.
and I appreciate
you're letting me
share with you
my notion of it
this evening.
Thank you.
We're going to
take about
a 10 or 15
minute break
and then do
question and
answers.
There are a bunch
of handouts,
catalogs,
events coming up,
stuff on tables
at the back
of the room
which I urge
you to take
a look at.
Yeah?
We're going
to start
very quickly
because
the philosophical
society
has asked
that we
wind ourselves
down.
I wanted
to call
your attention
to a couple
of things
before I
take questions.
Psilocybin,
the magic
mushroom
grower's
guide,
is back
in print
by popular
demand
and
at health
food stores
you buy
agar.
But I do
technical
consulting
for a hefty
hourly fee.
But this
can be gotten
at Bodhi
Tree,
it's longer,
it's on better
paper,
it has more
drawings,
it's a state
of the art
as we
could make
it.
It has
brought
freedom,
prosperity
and enlightenment
to tens
of thousands.
We have
not to be
outdone
by Tim
Leary,
we have
a piece
of software.
So if
you own
a 2E,
2C
or 2GS
machine
from Apple,
why you
can run
this time
wave software
which in
my opinion
is actually
my best
trick
and I
will be
writing
and talking
more and
more about
the wave
of time
because in
Hawaii
finally
developing
this software
gave me
a real
grip on
it.
Eventually
we will
market
this
for
Macintosh
and IBM
compatible
machinery
but right
now it's
in the
2E2C
line.
also I'd
like to
mention
that
Kat and
I will
be at
Esalen
next weekend
so if
any of
you are
true
gluttons
for
punishment
you can
join us
up there
for
two and
a half
days
and it
should be
lots of
fun.
That will
wind this
all up.
And before
I take
questions I
want to
again remind
you of
Botanical
Dimensions.
It is a
tax exempt
non-profit.
We do
need
donations.
All the
money that
is given
goes very
directly into
visibly
manifesting
the
Botanical
Garden
in Hawaii
collecting
the
plants
building
a
computer
database
and
basically
support
not even
supporting
but
keeping
a
Peruvian
collector
in the
field
since I'm
most familiar
with Amazonian
botany
why that's
where we've
concentrated.
Well usually
questions are
the most
interesting.
How is
this to be
done?
Are you
going to
hand a
microphone?
Do people
come up?
Stand up?
Stand up
and speak
loudly.
In the
middle,
in the
back.
Yes.
Yes,
parents.
I was
wondering if
you could
share with
this your
ideas on
what spirit
is.
Well I
think it's
my notion
of it is
that the
way we
experience it
it's an
informing
understanding.
It's on
one level
it's
simply
appropriate
activity
you know
knowing
how to
do
everything
because
it is
the
Tao of
the
ancestors.
In other
words you
can sort
of see
yourself
as the
most recent
version of
your family's
genes
and in
all
traditional
activities
there's
millions
of years
of
morphogenetic
fields
stored up
for how
you
pick
something
up
how you
sit
something
down.
So in
the immediate
sense
the
manifestation
of spirit
is appropriate
activity.
What it
really is
I think
is some
kind of
hidden
how-ness
that makes
everything
be as
it is
and that's
what the
spirit is.
In other
words science
describes
the possible
things
that can
happen.
Science is
the study
of
possibilities
and what
nobody has
ever answered
is how
is it
that out
of the
entire
class
of
possibilities
certain
things
actually
undergo
the
formality
of
occurring.
Somehow
they are
selected
out of
the class
of the
possible
and they
become
the
actual.
Well
the thing
which
mediates
the coming
into being
of the
actual
out of
the
class
of the
possible
is what
I think
the spirit
is.
It is
the
invisible
hand
if you
will.
It is
the
guiding
force.
It is
the
invisible
landscape
over
which
becoming
flows
like a
river.
It
defines.
It
creates.
It is
this
telos
that I
mentioned.
This
attractor
at the
end
of
time.
Other
yes
back
there.
Yes
sir
has there
been
any
research
that you
know of
in
relation
to
electron
spin
resonance
recently
since
the
landscape
and
secondly
can
triptomine
act as a
mechanism
for release
of genetically
stored
material
through that
ESR
with an
intercalation
of
triptomine
into the
neural
DNA.
Is that
a genetic
mechanism
for
racial
new
well in
the
invisible
landscape
that's
what we
were
suggesting
and the
invisible
landscape
was
published
in
since
then
there's
been a
lot of
work
with
NMR
and
ESR
none
of it
which
overthrows
this
idea
it's a
real
question
about
where is
the
epigenetic
data
stored
in other
words
all the
memories
that you
accumulate
during
your
life
die
with
you
your
genetic
material
you can
pass
on
at least
half
to your
children
and so
during the
life of
the
individual
this
epigenetic
material
experience
anecdotes
memories
anticipations
how
where is
it
molecularly
stored
or is
it
molecularly
stored
in the
invisible
landscape
we were
suggesting
that
thought
is
actually
a
naturally
occurring
ESR
readout
of
portions
of the
DNA
which
were not
associated
with
genetic
expression
but which
were
somehow
like
write
writeable
memory
in a
computer
the
epigenetic
stuff
was being
stored
there
there's
no
data
to
overthrow
that
notion
that I'm
aware
of
I'm
not
I don't
cling
to
it
as
strongly
as I
once
did
allowing
of
spirit
into
the
scientific
model
of
the
world
and
I
now
think
of
the
brain
as
a
receiver
of
the
phenomenon
of
consciousness
that
I
don't
believe
that
consciousness
is
generated
in the
brain
any
more
than
the
television
programs
are
made
inside
my
TV
you know
the box
is too
small
you know
that
I mean
it just
obviously
is
too
small
I
mean
it
might
not
be
if you
didn't
have
the
psychedelic
experience
once
you
splice
that
and
say
well
it's
taking
you
know
ten
high
sixteen
megabytes
of
memory
to
store
this
database
so
it
just
doesn't
I
just
don't
think
it
would
be
done
like
that
I
discover
right
already
somehow
present
in the
environment
it
is
the
appetition
for
being
that
drives
organic
evolution
into
this
kind
of
dance
of
relatedness
to
this
other
thing
which
it
can
transduce
from
another
dimension
that's
why
you
know
if
you
take
consciousness
expansion
the
phrase
or
consciousness
enhancement
seriously
it
must
be
very
important
because
consciousness
is
after
all
what
it's
all
made
out
of
that's
the
name
of
the
game
so
this
transducing
of
higher
states
of
consciousness
then
seems
very
important
even
at
that
it
will
be
necessary
to
elucidate
the
physical
mechanism
whether
it's
ESR
NMR
or
what
it
is
an
interesting
sort
of
opportunity
for
psychedelic
research
you
see
the
amazing
thing
about
psychedelics
is
not
only
that
they
are
illegal
and
restricted
from
the
so-called
ordinary
person
but
they
are
restricted
to
scientific
research
nobody
can
do
research
on
psychedelics
I
mean
it
is
professionally
and
practically
impossible
to do
it
well
there's
no
other
area
where
this
is
true
I
mean
science
probes
obscenely
into
the
most
private
areas
of
our
sex
lives
our
social
lives
our
dream
lives
monkeys
are
smashed
against
walls
to study
I
mean
there's
no
limit
to
it
and
yet
there's
this
total
hands-off
attitude
toward
the
psychedelics
so
an
interesting
break
in
this
front
is
the
sudden
need
because
of
computer
assisted
tomography
cat
scanning
the need
for
compounds
which
locate
in
certain
highly
defined
parts
of
the
brain
if
you
could
tritiate
these
drug
compounds
and make
them
radioactive
you could
make
very nice
pictures
of
various
parts
of
the
brain
so
now
suddenly
there
is
an
interest
in
all
this
old
psychedelic
research
about
the
receptor
site
and
location
densities
of
molecules
in
the
brain
so
we
may
be
on
the
brink
of
an
era
where
to
have
a
psilocybin
trip
in
the
on
for
a
cat
scan
at
general
hospital
in
the
morning
someone
else
I
have
a couple
questions
I guess
I'd like
to hear
just about
the
state
of
these
plants
that you
feel
that you
need
to
sort
of
rescue
them
from
the
Amazon
and
bring
them
into
Hawaii
and
how
many
have
preserved
that the
cultures
the
indigenous
rainforest
cultures
are more
and more
disrupted
and there's a lot
of conservation
and big
organizations
raising money
to preserve
the rainforests
and to get
large tracts
of rainforests
set aside
there is no
awareness
or social
conscience
about the
fact that
the presence
of capitalism
in the
Amazon
is totally
disrupting
tribal
human culture
so these
people
who have
been tribal
for thousands
of years
the men
are just
totally walking
out on the
traditional
lifestyle
and taking
their canoe
a hundred
miles down
river
and signing
on at
sawmills
and on
oil
drilling
crews
and this
sort of
thing
and so
the consequences
of this
is
that far
more rapidly
than the
rainforest
itself
is being
destroyed
the
human
cultural
interaction
with the
rainforest
is being
lost
and thousands
of species
of medicinal
plants
antibiotics
immune
stimulators
halucinogens
analgesics
all these
different kinds
of plants
this data
this lore
is being
lost
and when
you realize
that you know
eighty percent
of the drugs
sold in the
United States
are in fact
traceable
to plant
sources
and in spite
of the
vaunted
success
of so-called
strategic
pharmacology
where you
just
think up
the drug
you think
you need
and make
it in the
laboratory
it really
it's still
a lot
of the
of what
drug companies
do
is screen
for plants
and cash
in on
folklore
basically
so it's
important to
preserve these
plants
and the
lore about
them
because you
see I mean
like it's
really hard
to explain
how some
of these
plants have
been discovered
for instance
in the case
of ayahuasca
ayahuasca
is a
visionary
shamanic
brew
that happens
to be made
of two
two different
plants
vanisteriopsis
copy
supplies an
MAO
inhibitor
and
cicotria
viridis
supplies
DMT
either plant
by itself
is inert
and you
have to
know
to brew
the
wood
and bark
of one
with the
leaves
of the
other
and you
have to
know
that it's
in a
certain
proportion
and you
have to
know
to concentrate
it to a
certain
degree
well
when you
realize
that
a
square
mile
of
Amazonian
rainforest
can have
120,000
species
of plants
on it
I mean
that's in
contrast to
when you
go into
the
Sierras
a square
mile
of
forest
may have
species
of plants
in it
so
it's an
ultra-complex
environment
and human
beings
who knows
by what
means
I mean
it is to
my mind
that the
vegetable
spirits
lead them
to it
have
sussed out
all this
knowledge
that is
you know
a seamless
web of
understanding
about nature
and so
this is
what we're
trying to
preserve
in Hawaii
I think
ayahuasca
is a good
example
it has
tremendous
potential
for
psychiatry
it is
a purgative
it kills
intestinal
parasites
it appears
in agar
in slant
culture
to kill
the
germany
in the
united
states
to the
outback
of indonesia
where malaria
is raging
you could
simply
send in
thousands
of cuttings
of this
plant
people could
grow it
as a
dooryard
plant
take it
as a
tea
on a
weekly
basis
and
malaria
would be
held
at bay
there are
over
plants
in a
recent
review
article
that I
saw
known
from
Africa
that appear
to be
immune
stimulating
plants
well
god
this should
have
everybody
on the
edge
of their
seat
the
breakdown
of the
immune
system
and the
whole
AIDS
related
complex
and all
of that
it
turns
out
that
adaptations
to plants
in traditional
cultures
have
conferred
or have
stimulated
the immune
system
and conferred
certain kinds
of immunity
well then
this could be
the basis
for a
drug strategy
of some
sort
and so
on
so this
is the
kind of
preservational
work
that we're
doing
there
yes
against
the wall
a few
days ago
you were
on KPFK
with Roy
and you
mentioned
briefly
San Pedro
that's
what you
said
you were
talking
about
the
water
plant
San Pedro
cactus
could you
just
give me
briefly
a background
maybe a
parallel
between
the experience
or your
experience
if you
had
it
with
San Pedro
to that
of
psilocybin
mushrooms
because when
I tried
San Pedro
cactus
mixing it
with vanilla
ice cream
didn't work
well I
don't know
what work
means
but it
must have
startled
your
stomach
it was
pretty
vile
well I
don't really
know that
much about
San Pedro
I've never
gotten around
to it
I know
a person
who swears
by it
but they
have a
elaborate way
of cooking
it up
in a
pressure
cooker
mescaline
which
and
halamine
and
halamine
and
methyl
mescaline
all of
these
things
are
occurring
in
that
plant
it's
an
amphetamine
related
thing
it
tends
to be
pretty
rough
of
the
of
the
natural
hallucinogens
the
really
the
big
ones
as I
think
of
them
mescaline
is
the
harshest
an
operating
dose
is
considered
to be
actually
close
to
a
gram
milligrams
which
one
way
that
pharmacologists
judge
the
toxicity
of
a
drug
is
by
how
much
it
takes
to
get
you
off
and
the
less
it
takes
then
the
more
benign
the
drug
is
thought
to
be
so
on
that
scale
mescaline
doesn't
do
too
well
but
my
experience
with
mescaline
has
been
with
peyote
which
I
gather
is
somewhat
similar
and
it's
been
interesting
it's
hard
to
take
enough
to
really
reach
the
deep
you
have
to
water without it really reacting on your stomach it's not the cleanest way to go I think that you
know having looked at these things in South America and in many places in my experience the mushroom
just is it I mean other things have other aspects to it and bring it in but the mushroom is an
extraordinary organism it's like it's engineered for that purpose and I've spoken about how it was
almost strewn in the path of developing primitive man in Africa because it was associated with the
manure of cattle and on the in the ungulate herds of Africa evolving on the belt at the same time that
the human animal was evolving a complex pack signaling language and so forth it just set the
stage it seems to me it was the catalyst I really believe that we are in a symbiotic relationship with
these plants and that the mushroom by virtue of being global in its distribution is probably a
major slice relationally of that pie and in other in other words that the peculiar turn that evolution
took in our species the reinforcing of self-reflective consciousness and the reinforcing of linguistic
signaling has to do with the presence in the human diet in that early stage of these mushrooms it's known
that the mushroom that low amounts of psilocybin subthreshold doses of psilocybin increase visual acuity
well it isn't hard to figure then that if evolutionary pressure is operating on a hunting species a pack
hunting species that visual acuity is going to be at a premium and if small amounts of psilocybin in the food
chain increase increase increase visual acuity those animals will be selected and survive well then their
habit of using of accepting the mushroom as a food lays them open for this linguistic synergy this symbol
forming capacity then and then the the deeper more ecstatic experiences with psilocybin which are then
projected onto the mushroom onto the cattle become the basis for a kind of cattle goddess mushroom
a cycle of a hierophany the discovery of the tremendum i mean almost as though in the scene in 2001 where the apes
encounter the monolith it was precisely that except that the monolith was a mushroom it was a superbly genetically engineered
omnivorous organism that could insert itself into the ecosystem of a planet and begin to coax
an effect out of a mammal that it had a relationship to and this effect coaxed out of the mammal is
is this relationship to this higher dimensional wave form which we call the spirit or mind which is apparently
you know that's what it's all about why this is happening is not clear i mean in the mushroom book i suggested that
it was because there is some awareness of planetary finitude that the mushroom actually thinks on so large a scale
that it is using us to make machines for it to perpetuate it throughout the nearby galaxy that it is aware of the finite nature of our star
star we don't know we don't know we don't plan yet on those kind of scales we're an infant race
very obstreperous and the mushroom said to me once
if you don't have a plan you become part of somebody else's plan one of its slightly more paranoid
but it is good i think to have a plan and to have allies and the mushroom is very contemptuous of the notion of
of humans having human allies says you know for one human being to think it could gain enlightenment from another
so it really believes in you know hierarchical levels and trickle-down gnosis which i'm not sure how i view that
i believe all secrets should be told and that we should just lay our cards on the table
but maybe i don't have as many cards as they do so we play by their rules on the aisle
you're a wonderful convincing speaker and i'm sure nobody hears that in case they do not want to bear witness
and testimony to what you're saying
um
it's absolutely true
that there's this intelligence that wants to connect to us and that we won't need to make a record to connect to us
because as you say it is extremely informative
and uh
you're saying um
that one way we can do this is through the psychedelic experience which i agree with
but i'd like you to talk a little bit about the western tradition of the mysteries which involves ritual
and using ritual in order to maintain uh
to uh uh
stimulate
maintain contact with this nature spirit which uh i might add is
uh is a spirit that's just bursting at the seams right now to connect to us and inform us and talk to us
and help us
yes
well um
um
Mersiliad talked about the difference between sacral and profane time
and he said the way you leave history
is you sacralize a space
and you sacralize a space through ritual
you
you abolish the profane constraints of space and time the here and now
and
you
imagine that you are what he what he called
in ilio tempore
in the time before
in the paradisical time before the fall
this goes back to what i said about the anuttatara yoga tantra
the imagining
of these titanic god-like states of mind
as a ground for being
yes
i would never have thought
i mean i've been pushed to my
position by my experience
i mean i'm amazed at what i have to say
based on what i've experienced
because i never thought it would be this way
you know i came up a whole different way
i was a marxist
and an existentialist
and all of these
things
and it was as you testified
it's the pure evidence
i mean you can
you can convince yourself
intellectually that something is true
but it's only in the
in the
embrace of the tremendum
that it just sweeps over you
how true it is
and
as far as the difference between establishing
these connections through psychedelics
and through ritual
i think deep psychedelic tripping
is something that you don't do very often
simply because each time
it's so rich
it takes a long time
to process this stuff
it's much better to go deeper
seldom
than
to diddle with it in the other ways
that people do
i mean it often seems to me that
it's not even so much a matter of
of
you know
spreading the good word
and turning it into a mass movement
it might be much more interesting
if simply the people who were already in
on the secret
did it
more conscientiously
and more deeply
although
i hasten to add that you shouldn't do too much
you should never do
more than about
six or seven grams
of mushrooms
i say that
because i keep hearing stories about
people who think
going deeply means
doing a lot
and they do amounts
which stand my hair on end
i mean in the past month
traveling around
i've heard stories
where i just say
you know
and people are crazy
you know
say
i couldn't remember whether you said
five grams or five ounces
so to be safe i did an ounce and a half
you know
i mean
it's important to
it's important to get there
granted
but it's important to come back
oh lord
yeah
in your talks
you
said something about the transcendental object
did you go into more detail about that
the way i imagine that history works
is
well first of all let me say how the way
the people i disagree with think it works
and then
you had cooling
and development
of
molecular atomic and molecular and organic
and ultimately cultural
and all
systems and ultimately technological systems
and
this will go on indefinitely
down unto the heat death of the universe
and the development of life
and of culture
has nothing to do
with the physical
astrophysical level of things
it's sort of ancillary and a mistake
my view is somewhat different
it's that
if we have to have a singularity
in our cosmology
in other words
it's so hard to figure out
how you get from nothing to something
no philosophical school
has ever been able to do it
without some kind of singularity
so if we're going to have a singularity
in our system
let us try to make it as
logically palatable as possible
so how to do that
it's not logically palatable to me
to believe
that the universe
sprang from nothing
in a single instant
seems to me
if you believe that
you're set up to believe anything
right
i mean isn't that it
well if they'll believe this
what wouldn't you believe
so how about this instead
that the universe
its origins
are a mystery
and cannot be determined
but as we look at its history
the history of it that is available to our inspection
what we see is increasing complexity
ending in ourselves
and our civilization so far as we know
well then if you're going to have a singularity
I think of a singularity as a kind of phase transition
you know Ilya Prigozhin talks about how
a chemical system will suddenly and spontaneously migrate
to a higher state of order
well that's sort of how I think of this thing
it is capable of migrating to a higher state of order
so
if we're going to have a singularity
isn't it more likely that it will emerge out of a situation of vast complexity
than a situation of utter metaphysical nothingness
I think so
so I think that what the transcendental object is
is it is
the cause of the universe if you will
except that this cause
is at what we would conventionally refer to as the end
it's what everything flows toward
it isn't something wound up which runs down
it's something diffuse which is gathered in to something
and this gathering in takes the form
not only of a progressive densification at the physical level
but of a progressive complexification at the organizational level
it also is a kind of a spiral
it has a temporal closure
so that each epoch of closure
happens more quickly than the ones which preceded it
and what I mean by that is
it took the you know the universe is twenty billion years old
the first five billion years it
well no
the first ten billion years it was all about star formation
and nuclear cook down
of heavier elements out of lighter elements
and then you get molecules
which signify a higher level of organization
which can only go on at a lower temperature
so as temperature leaves the universe
more complex systems become possible
and then ultimately polymers of great lengths become possible
so this complexification is occurring
and it is at each stage more rapid than the last
now the emergence of self-reflection
of self-reflection in our own species
is part of this
it isn't a fluke
it isn't an accident
it is obedient to the same natural law
which created these other systems
and the emergence of our own curiously alienated
and at odds with itself culture
is also a part of this phenomenon
we are initiating a kind of crisis
with the planet
it is in the same way that a fetus
will become septic
if it is carried too far beyond term
there is a crisis now
in the Gaia human system
the two must be parted
and the transcendental object
is this knitting together
of the organic intent of the planet
to somehow expel us
from the planetary environment
in some way which is very hard for us
to foresee and anticipate
because it is in fact
the transcendental object
I mean by appointing a committee
to look into this
we are not going to find out what it is
it is the face of the abyss
it is the transcendental object
it cannot entirely be known
it is the living embodiment
of Gödel's incompleteness theorem
you know science has taught us
that there are no mysteries
there are only unsolved problems
this is a mystery
not an unsolved problem
nevertheless
it is the narrowing vector
of our timeline
and as some of you probably know
in my opinion
around 2012 AD
we will cross into
cross through novel epochs
of concrescence
and the transcendental object
will be manifest
it is a very curious thing
it is something which is coming toward us
from the future
but we are creating
out of our intellectual
and technological anticipation
of deity really
I mean at times
I have spoken of it
as the flying saucer
it is the flying saucer
and it does enter history
at a certain moment
and it is coming toward us
but as we
go toward it
we are becoming
what we behold
in effect
what I am saying
is that the entirety
of human history
is a kind of
psychedelic apotheosis
where we are involved
in a hieroskamos
a kind of alchemical marriage
and what the
you know
what the next 25 years
are about
is advancing
to meet the bride
and the bride
is the unimaginable
and un
un
anticipatable
fulfillment of our heart's desire
you know
we are becoming
what we behold
our metaphysical
hypostatization
of deity
is becoming
a cultural
program
for
our
completion
and that is why
communication
is so important
because what we are
trying to do
is
articulate
this
vision
of
the
oversoul
of our
species
we are going
into a kind
of swarm
state
where there is
a
pheromonal
transformation
of our cultural
modalities
our
pheromones
are information
systems
and now
information
systems
ideologies
are being released
into the mass
psyche
that actually
set us up
to undergo
this cultural
compression
and
concrescence
that the experience
of the
transcendental
object
is
if you haven't read
William Gibson
you might give him
a go
his anticipation
of a cybernetic
future
is part
of
the anticipation
of the transcendental
object
and what Gibson is saying
in Neuromancer
and Count Zero
is
that
data
storage
in hyperspace
will become
conventionalized
the way the
grids of cities
are conventionalized
in three-dimensional
space
so that when you
jack in
to cyberspace
you will find
you know
you will see
the Bank of America
database
like an enormous
red neon
oblong
glowing off to your
left
and over the horizon
the Transworld
Airlines database
in other words
the dimension
of culture
which
for
fifteen thousand
years or so
has been
for purposes
of comparison
let's say
as thin as a thick
sheet of paper
I mean
what has culture been
it's been a few
mud huts
some brick streets
a cathedral
here and there
recently
and then more recently
a lot of knitted
together
electrified
cheap
construction
suddenly
the dimension
of culture
is about
to be
which is
orthogonal
to ordinary reality
is about to be
expanded
a hundred
a thousand fold
into
a complete
mind space
the cyber space
that
Gibson
is talking about
the psychedelic space
that shamans
have always
known about
is about to be
uh
activated
as a cultural
artifact
in high-tech
uh
high-tech
society
where we will
become whatever
we imagine
you know
you will move off
into this
electronically
sustained
realm of mind
at least that's
how i imagine it
i imagine
that passage
through the transcendental object
leads into
the imagination
and that the imagination
is really our true home
and that all of this
electronics
and culture
and art
and drugs
and magic
and ritual
is
about
the prodigal return
to the imagination
as a cultural norm
and
uh
and
uh
the transcendental object
represents the narrow neck
the narrowest place
the place
where
the phase transition
occurs
at least that's what i hope
that's what i feel
the symbiosis
with the hallucinogens
hallucinogens
is coaxing out of us
because we cannot go
to the stars
in the ape
mindset
you know
with ape politics
and
uh
it's just impossible
and very clearly
we are on the brink
of taking control
of our own
self-image
this
is what the long
cultural march
has been
this is the justification
if there is one
for science
is that it does
give us
a certain measure
of control
over stuff
and it's out of
it is the
the mirror of our minds
that we will make
out of stuff
that we will eventually
perform
this magical evocation
in front of
and walk
through
into
the time
outside
of history
the place
before history
another question
somebody over here
yes
Terence welcome to LA
people who have
listened so many hours
on the radio
I just want to say
we really love you
and I just think
that's important to say
all right
afterwards then
I take the show
on my ECR
and I get it
during the day
but anyway
I was going to go
to Mexico
to a little village
up in Oaxaca
and my companion
sort of convinced me
that it might not
be the best idea
because
while you are
looking around
for green men
you might find
some federales
or something
and it might not
be the best place
to totally
let go
so I decided
to grow some mushrooms
and that just ended up
on the low priority
of things
and I still haven't
grown them
but I was always
of the fantasy
that going
to this place
in Mexico
there was something
magic there
and there was this
quote unquote
morphic resonance
and I wanted
to know
if there was
a morphic resonance
wouldn't that be
in the negative
time space frame
and so my question
is one
do you buy
this morphic resonance
idea
and
that's the question
yeah
well
my
one of the best
people
one of the very
very best people
that I've found
in the
in the so-called
new age
is Rupert
Rupert Sheldrake
I mean
he and I are
tight
and
we've spent a lot
of time just
pushing these ideas
around
ultimately
I think
probably
he's very much
onto something
it's interesting
that it's such a
considered such a
radical idea
because think about
what it says
it says
that things
are as they are
because they were
as they were
one can hardly
imagine
a more conservative
philosophy
in fact
the
the problem
for this
philosophy
is to therefore
explain how
anything
ever
manages to
be different
how any kind
of novelty
could emerge
out of a situation
where the past
is so present
that it
configures
everything
so
Rupert's idea
and my idea
which I haven't
discussed except by
implication tonight
but I have this
notion
which is embodied
in the software
of a wave
of novelty
a way of
quantifying the
flux of the
Tao
and a wave
of novelty
would be
necessary
to
for Sheldrake's
idea
to support
the coming
into being
of new forms
I mentioned
this evening
in the main body
of my talk
the term
compressionism
I just sort of
begun to think
about this
I like it
because I like
impressionism
abstract expressionism
surrealism
I like it
because it's an
art movement
not a science
but I would
number the
compressionists
that come to
mind
to be
Rupert Sheldrake
Abraham
Frank Barr
and myself
bringing up
the rear
and
we all
four of us
have a slice
on it
each different
but each leading
to this same
set of conclusions
that there is
a set of
hidden variables
which we all
describe
differently
but that
these hidden
variables
are channeling
the development
of events
and what this
signifies is a
new way of
thinking about
time
and it's all
very much
in flux
Rupert is a
true
a true
great
scientist
and gentleman
if the theory
of morphic resonance
can be overthrown
it will be
and he will lead
the charge
our effort
when we get
together
much of our effort
is experimental
design
to try to think
of experiments
that would
disprove
the notion
because it is
a notion
which asserts
very firmly
certain strange
things about reality
should be
measurable
and discernible
so
morphic resonance
my novelty
waves
the dynamic
attractors
of Ralph Abraham
and
the
fractal hierarchies
of Frank
Barr
are all
embryonic
efforts
there is a feeling
in the air
a sense
of an idea
to be
nailed down
and I am convinced
you know
that in the next
ten or fifteen years
one of us
or somebody
we know
or somebody
sitting at the table
nearby
will
work it out
it is really
the great
intellectual adventure
of our time
and it
carries us
all along
with it
when this thing
is figured out
it is going to be
understandable
to all
of us
it is going to
end
the era
of the professional
abstraction
you know
for the new paradigm
to work
it is going to have
to transform
the lives
of hundreds
of millions
of people
the point
that has been missed
by the proponents
of
some of the more
narrow
versions
of what the new paradigm
is
the new paradigm
will be
an understandable
explanation
of the world
understandable
to whom
to you
to me
not
an abstraction
sanctioned
by a professional elite
and handed down
by the academy
to be
translated
into numbers
in order
to convince
straight society
of its existence
well that's
the beauty
and the wonder
and the delight
of time wave zero
absolutely
I mean this
this was produced
to convince
scientists
what this thing does
is it draws
graphs
of the ingression
of novelty
into time
I advance
novelty
as a new
primary quality
of the space
time continuum
on a par
with charge
spin
angular momentum
novelty
this is the realm
of the hidden
variables
and this program
this program
may
thousands of
experimentally testable
assertions this is not
smoke and mirrors stuff
you give it an end date
you give it a date of interest
and it draws a
mathematically defined graph of
its opinion as
to where the flux of novelty
and habituation these are
the two opposed quantities
novelty and habituation
where they fall vis-a-vis
this event system
so every time you activate
the program it fills
the monitor
with a screen full of
precise predictions
about known
historical phenomena
so it seems to me
if there were a body of
informed give and
take on the matter
we could quickly settle whether it's
just that I smoke too many little
brown cigarettes or
that this kind of
thinking is in fact
going to underlie and
restructure science
it's all right
I mean why should we assume
that the basic
qualities
of the universe
have been defined
as of
by modern physics
after all modern physics
doesn't explain
the unicorn
or the flower
so there must be
more
at work
in the universal mix
than we have
perceived
well I think I'll do
one more question
Robert
am I hearing this right
just like a historical
time graph
of human events
yes
that's exactly
what it is
it's a
way of looking
at the life
of an individual
or a society
and asking
the question
see
the way I think
this will be
this is good
because
the spirit
to eastern
philosophy
is the Tao
and the Tao
is the
howness
of the way
things happen
well we are
so accustomed
to allowing
these eastern
forms of thought
to remain
largely
formally
undefined
that we never
ask obvious
questions
about the Tao
for existence
for example
in the
Tao Te Ching
the opening
words in the
Weili
translation
are
the way
that can be
told of
is not
an unvarying
way
ok
it's a double
negative
it's not
an unvarying
way
means
it's a
varying
way
well anything
which varies
is modulated
that's a
mathematical
term
that has
precise meaning
so if the
way that can
be told of
is not
an unvarying
way
then it
can be
mathematically
described
as a
set of
integers
in flux
the
problem
then becomes
what
integers
well
that's a
long story
but
it's all
in here
it's
and I'm
you know
not
mad enough
to claim
that this
particular
take
this particular
set of
integers
is correct
I'm very
impressed
by its
successes
but I
am convinced
that a
theory of
this class
will eventually
explicate
time
is the
spirit
not
the time
of flat
duration
in the
Newtonian
universe
or the
very slightly
curved
time
of Einstein's
universe
but time
as lived
from moment
to moment
it flows
like a river
it runs
here quickly
there slow
and deep
here there
are cataracts
here there
are vast
lakes
form
and all
sense
of direction
is momentarily
lost
time
is
the
continuum
upon which
our entire
experience
of being
is deployed
and yet
up until
very recently
the only
model
we've had
of it
was this
flat
or slightly
curved
surface
that didn't
explain
the vicissitudes
and the
synchronicities
and the
mysteries
of our
own lives
now
if we
take a
fractal
model of
time
the kind
of fractals
that we
see in
the psychedelic
experience
and the
kinds of
fractals
that we
see when
we unleash
computers
in the realm
of pure
mathematics
then we
begin to
see the
time
of pure
experience
the time
that we
recognize
where every
day is
like every
other
but different
every year
is like
every other
but different
we grow
but we
stay the
same
we move
forward
at the same
time that we
move backwards
all of these
kinds of
feeling toned
complexes
about movement
and time
are handled
very well
in the
fractal
so the
Tao
what the
psychedelic
experience
has done
for me
above and
beyond
the heart
opening
and what
it's done
for me
as a
person
what it's
done
for me
as a
seeker
after truth
has given
me
this total
description
of reality
and I think
our senses
and our minds
and our hearts
are always
trying to
give us
a total
map
a total
mandala
is always
trying to
emerge
out of
the chaos
of
perception
but it
appears to
me that
it can
happen to
any depth
and if you
still your
mind with
psychedelics
and with
discipline
and you
look into
the black
rivers that
flow through
our hearts
and our
minds
eventually
you see
not only
the truth
of yourself
not only
the truth
of ourselves
but
formal
truth
the truth
of mathematics
and then
you have
sort of
made a
kind of
closure
and so
this is
what
this was
my
personal
meditation
in time
wave
zero
I
urge you
to
take a
look
at it
because
it's
the most
original
thing
that I
have
done
the rest
is the
descriptive
diaries
of an
explorer
well
footnoted
which I
share
with you
gladly
but this
other thing
was actually
you know
the logos
from on
high
that was
what
my
particular
relationship
to the
spirit
was based
around
the revelation
of this
particular
idea
because I
had no
interest
in the
I Ching
still
less
in mathematics
and all
of the
disciplines
that
impinged
on this
notion
but somehow
you know
I was
chosen
virtually
because I
was standing
around
when the
decision
was made
I mean
I really
believe
that
and
these
things
only mean
something
as they
are
communicated
but you
see
we have
great
anxiety
about the
future
and if
there were
in fact
fractal
maps
of the
future
then that
anxiety
would leave
us
and would
leave us
free
and in
one sense
I think
that's the
transcendental
object
it's the
manifestation
of the
spirit
the spirit
is with
us
throughout
historical
time and
space
but it
is
concretized
at
history's
end
well that's
all I have
to say
we're
five minutes
over
I
appreciate
your
being
here
very
much
time
is
good
time
to
time
to